Electric Cars Good for the Environment?
in [Manchester United]
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From: Mark Williams on 31 Jul 2010 11:15 "Lawrence Jenkins" <lawrence13(a)sky.com> wrote in message news:4c5436e1$0$21651$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com... > I don't know how carrying so much weight in storage batteries is > efficient. Very simple. The batteries can power motors attached directly to the wheels which are much smaller and lighter than the internal combustioon engine without the gears, clutch and everything else that is needed to run a petrol engine, plus the chassis required to support all that machinery. > The sensible sized cars can do no more than 80 miles before a recharge. > Even cars like the Prius still rely heavily on a petrol engine. How mad > can it be that a combustion engine is made even less efficient as it has > to lug around the weight of the batteries and elecric drive motors and > vice versa. I don't believe there's much space left for luggage . The Tesla has a range of 250 miles, but this will improve as battery technology improves. > > As for a cleaner atmosphere where do you think the waste gases go at the > generating station Never Never Land? Carbon capture, although there could be more generation from non-carbon sources including nuclear. > > If motorist in britain switch to electric cars then the natial grid demand > would increase with more oil, gas and coal being burnt to meet the demand > and as far as I know that means exhaust fumes at the power station instead > of where the vehicle burns the fuel. True but oil and gas will run out eventually, replaced by other energy sources. It would only take an area the size of Austria in the Sahara Desert to generate electricity for all of the world's energy needs.
From: Lawrence13 on 31 Jul 2010 11:37 On Jul 31, 4:15 pm, "Mark Williams" <spam...(a)your.peril> wrote: > "Lawrence Jenkins" <lawrenc...(a)sky.com> wrote in message > > news:4c5436e1$0$21651$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com... > > > I don't know how carrying so much weight in storage batteries is > > efficient. > > Very simple. The batteries can power motors attached directly to the wheels > which are much smaller and lighter than the internal combustioon engine > without the gears, clutch and everything else that is needed to run a petrol > engine, plus the chassis required to support all that machinery. > > > The sensible sized cars can do no more than 80 miles before a recharge. > > Even cars like the Prius still rely heavily on a petrol engine. How mad > > can it be that a combustion engine is made even less efficient as it has > > to lug around the weight of the batteries and elecric drive motors and > > vice versa. I don't believe there's much space left for luggage . > > The Tesla has a range of 250 miles, but this will improve as battery > technology improves. > > > > > As for a cleaner atmosphere where do you think the waste gases go at the > > generating station Never Never Land? > > Carbon capture, although there could be more generation from non-carbon > sources including nuclear. > > > > > If motorist in britain switch to electric cars then the natial grid demand > > would increase with more oil, gas and coal being burnt to meet the demand > > and as far as I know that means exhaust fumes at the power station instead > > of where the vehicle burns the fuel. > > True but oil and gas will run out eventually, replaced by other energy > sources. It would only take an area the size of Austria in the Sahara > Desert to generate electricity for all of the world's energy needs. If oil and gas run out then it will prove very hard to run and electric car-they will be usless unless nuclear or hydro like in Sweden is generating their elecricity.
From: Lawrence13 on 31 Jul 2010 11:40 On Jul 31, 4:15 pm, "Mark Williams" <spam...(a)your.peril> wrote: > "Lawrence Jenkins" <lawrenc...(a)sky.com> wrote in message > > news:4c5436e1$0$21651$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com... > > > I don't know how carrying so much weight in storage batteries is > > efficient. > > Very simple. The batteries can power motors attached directly to the wheels > which are much smaller and lighter than the internal combustioon engine > without the gears, clutch and everything else that is needed to run a petrol > engine, plus the chassis required to support all that machinery. > > > The sensible sized cars can do no more than 80 miles before a recharge. > > Even cars like the Prius still rely heavily on a petrol engine. How mad > > can it be that a combustion engine is made even less efficient as it has > > to lug around the weight of the batteries and elecric drive motors and > > vice versa. I don't believe there's much space left for luggage . > > The Tesla has a range of 250 miles, but this will improve as battery > technology improves. > > > > > As for a cleaner atmosphere where do you think the waste gases go at the > > generating station Never Never Land? > > Carbon capture, although there could be more generation from non-carbon > sources including nuclear. > > > > > If motorist in britain switch to electric cars then the natial grid demand > > would increase with more oil, gas and coal being burnt to meet the demand > > and as far as I know that means exhaust fumes at the power station instead > > of where the vehicle burns the fuel. > > True but oil and gas will run out eventually, replaced by other energy > sources. It would only take an area the size of Austria in the Sahara > Desert to generate electricity for all of the world's energy needs. Sorry Mark just saw the bit about somwhere the size of Austria in the sahara. I take it you mean with solar photovoltaic panels?
From: Mark Williams on 31 Jul 2010 19:42 "Lawrence13" <lawrence13(a)sky.com> wrote in message news:b381d940-abf4-43ce-a874-af2b8910d426(a)i28g2000yqa.googlegroups.com... On Jul 31, 4:15 pm, "Mark Williams" <spam...(a)your.peril> wrote: > "Lawrence Jenkins" <lawrenc...(a)sky.com> wrote in message > > news:4c5436e1$0$21651$c3e8da3(a)news.astraweb.com... > > > I don't know how carrying so much weight in storage batteries is > > efficient. > > Very simple. The batteries can power motors attached directly to the > wheels > which are much smaller and lighter than the internal combustioon engine > without the gears, clutch and everything else that is needed to run a > petrol > engine, plus the chassis required to support all that machinery. > > > The sensible sized cars can do no more than 80 miles before a recharge. > > Even cars like the Prius still rely heavily on a petrol engine. How mad > > can it be that a combustion engine is made even less efficient as it has > > to lug around the weight of the batteries and elecric drive motors and > > vice versa. I don't believe there's much space left for luggage . > > The Tesla has a range of 250 miles, but this will improve as battery > technology improves. > > > > > As for a cleaner atmosphere where do you think the waste gases go at the > > generating station Never Never Land? > > Carbon capture, although there could be more generation from non-carbon > sources including nuclear. > > > > > If motorist in britain switch to electric cars then the natial grid > > demand > > would increase with more oil, gas and coal being burnt to meet the > > demand > > and as far as I know that means exhaust fumes at the power station > > instead > > of where the vehicle burns the fuel. > > True but oil and gas will run out eventually, replaced by other energy > sources. It would only take an area the size of Austria in the Sahara > Desert to generate electricity for all of the world's energy needs. Sorry Mark just saw the bit about somwhere the size of Austria in the sahara. I take it you mean with solar photovoltaic panels? Yup. Not sugesting that it should be built in the Sahara, but there is plenty enough solar energy even if PV cells are currently expensive.
From: johnty on 1 Aug 2010 08:13
On 31 July, 15:44, "Lawrence Jenkins" <lawrenc...(a)sky.com> wrote: > > I don't know how carrying so much weight in storage batteries is efficient. It's about comparisons. It doesn't matter what load is being carried, elctric cars are more efficient at it than the equivalent petrol car in terms of energy used. You really are struggling with this. Try something less intellectually challenging for a while. > The sensible sized cars can do no more than 80 miles before a recharge. This is a different argument. There is no dispute that electric vehicles are nowhere near are well developed as petrol cars, but that has no bearing on the environment or efficiency in energy use. > cars like the Prius still rely heavily on a petrol engine. How mad can it be > that a combustion engine is made even less efficient as it has to lug around > the weight of the batteries and elecric drive motors and vice versa. Yet another, equally irrelevant argument. Start a new thread on hybrid vs. petrol vs electric. > As for a cleaner atmosphere where do you think the waste gases go at the > generating station Never Never Land? Cleaner in that the exhaust fumes that might have been generated aren't. Generating stations output is there regardless. I suspect you are more familiar with Never Never Land than most of us. > > If motorist in britain switch to electric cars then the natial grid demand > would increase with more oil, gas and coal being burnt to meet the demand > and as far as I know that means exhaust fumes at the power station instead > of where the vehicle burns the fuel. You really are clueless. Yes, there is an extra load on the power station to charge up an electric car. But, if this car has replaced a petrol one then you have to deduct the burden that the petrol-driven car would put on the power station, don't you? And as you are incapable of figuring it out, I'll give you some hints: the gallon of fuel burnt by the petrol car has to be extracted from the ground (very energy intesive), pumped down a pipe to a vessel of some sort to be transported (fuel burnt, exhaust emitted) to a refinery (large dirty thing not unlike a power station). The refinery cracks the hydrocarbons (large energy requirement, exhausts fumes, other pollutants), producing among other things, petrol. The petrol is loaded into a tanker and driven (more fuel used, more exhaust) to a garage (lights, pumps, 24hr shop). All of these things are avoided if replacing the traditional car with an electric one. The total energy requirement to fuel and run the petrol car exceeds the energy requirment to fuel and run the electric one over the equivalent distance. And the environmetal pollution is greater, too. |