Spain recreation (a game)
in [World Football]
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From: milivella on 22 Jul 2010 19:50 Futbolmetrix: > It looks as if similarity of ability is more important than similarity of > playing style. Too simplicistic. But my statement in the original post ("scrap ability level!") was too simplicistic as well (and of course wronger, since you shouldn't post wrong tips in the original post!!!). The point is that I've never understood how FM single abilities work: e.g. if you check the players with the max dribbling value, you have a couple of world class players and a couple of players affiliated with Turkish clubs (no disrespect intended). It looks like an average between the player's absolute value in that ability (e.g. dribbling) and the relative value of that ability compared to the other abilities of the same players (e.g. shooting)... What I can say for sure is that, if you take the whole database minus Spain XI (i.e. there are still Spanish and Dutch players) and you pick the 10 most similar players to Casillas, the 10 most similar to Ramos, etc., their average current ability (= global value) is 142. And a player with CA 142 is the 700th best player in the world. I.e. not Sunday league level, but not world class. And - even if this tells more about my ignorance than about those players - I don't know a lot of these 110 players (the 10 players most similar to each of the Spanish ones). BTW, there is a player who is among the 10 most similar players for *three* different elements of the Spanish side. I know him :) and nobody has named so far. And he's not a midget! (179 cm) > That said, I > wonder if we can do any better than the current best team. Maybe you could > post just the scores of the clones, without posting their names? Great idea. Here are the best possible scores: > > > Casillas, Iker > > Júlio César > > 142 > > Given what was said above about ability, this is going to be very difficult > to beat. No: J. Cesar is not among the top 10 clones, and we can go down to 113. :) > > Sergio Ramos > > Ivanovic, Branislav > > 147 > > Right defenders who can on occasion also play CD, good in the air and a > threat on set pieces. Hmmm... 124... > > Piqué, Gerard > > Nesta, Alessandro > > 151 > > We should be able to do better than this Indeed: 102... > > Puyol, Carles > > Cannavaro, Fabio > > 157 123 > FM overestimates Cannavaro's current skills. (145th player in the world, 23th central defender. A bit overrated.) > > Capdevila, Joan > > Cole, Ashley > > 156 100 > How about Abidal, or Maxwell? If someone picks them... Or we could have unlimited submission per RSSer (as long as the limit to already picked players remains!). > > Busquets, Sergio > > Touré, Yaya > > 121 > > Difficult to beat. You can go down to 105. And Toure isn't among the 10 players most similar to Busquets! > > Xabi Alonso > > Gago, Fernando > > 109 > > Looks pretty cloneworthy. He is! Gago is the perfect Xabi Alonso clone! :) > > Iniesta, Andrés > > Nasri, Samir > > 127 > > Difficult to beat Indeed. Nasri is 3rd. The best possible score is 125. Iniesta is Iniesta is Iniesta. > > Xavi > > Pirlo, Andrea > > 99 > > Wow, must be the clone! He is! > > Pedro > > Arshavin, Andrey > > 172 > > Here I think we have to look for someone not quite as established as the > names we have made so far. Hmm, I know just 2 of the 10 best Pedro clones... The best one scores 114. > > Villa, David > > Tevez, Carlos > > 125 > > Difficult to beat. True: Tevez is 2nd! There is just a 124 above him. Summing up: Xabi-Gago and Xavi-Pirlo are perfect couples. Among the other players, there is a lot of room for improvement in some cases, almost no room in other. The least clonable Spanish player is Iniesta, the most clonable is Xavi (at least, he has one good clone!). And finally the answer to the most crucial question: the distance among the two generic midgets (I mean Xavi and Iniesta!) is... 152! -- Cheers milivella
From: Diabolik on 22 Jul 2010 20:19 > Xavi > Pirlo, Andrea > 99 > Pirlo fitter as DM. > (this was the first pairing that came to my mind! The second one was > Carrick for Xabi Alonso.) Pilro was my first choice too, but I would have thought he was a lot slower than Xavi so I left him out.
From: Abubakr on 22 Jul 2010 23:02 On Jul 23, 9:50 am, milivella <milive...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Futbolmetrix: > > > It looks as if similarity of ability is more important than similarity of > > playing style. > > Too simplicistic. But my statement in the original post ("scrap > ability level!") was too simplicistic as well (and of course wronger, > since you shouldn't post wrong tips in the original post!!!). The > point is that I've never understood how FM single abilities work: e.g. > if you check the players with the max dribbling value, you have a > couple of world class players and a couple of players affiliated with > Turkish clubs (no disrespect intended). It looks like an average > between the player's absolute value in that ability (e.g. dribbling) > and the relative value of that ability compared to the other abilities > of the same players (e.g. shooting)... > > What I can say for sure is that, if you take the whole database minus > Spain XI (i.e. there are still Spanish and Dutch players) and you pick > the 10 most similar players to Casillas, the 10 most similar to Ramos, > etc., their average current ability (= global value) is 142. And a > player with CA 142 is the 700th best player in the world. I.e. not > Sunday league level, but not world class. > > And - even if this tells more about my ignorance than about those > players - I don't know a lot of these 110 players (the 10 players most > similar to each of the Spanish ones). BTW, there is a player who is > among the 10 most similar players for *three* different elements of > the Spanish side. I know him :) and nobody has named so far. And he's > not a midget! (179 cm) > > > That said, I > > wonder if we can do any better than the current best team. Maybe you could > > post just the scores of the clones, without posting their names? > > Great idea. Here are the best possible scores: > > > > > > Casillas, Iker > > > Júlio César > > > 142 > > > Given what was said above about ability, this is going to be very difficult > > to beat. > > No: J. Cesar is not among the top 10 clones, and we can go down to > 113. :) This was a surprise. They are similar goalies in terms of style: both left-footed shot stoppers at the short to medium end of the height spectrum for goalies, good at distribution. I thought Julio Cesar would have scored better. Other suggestions: Akinfeev , Frey ( I think both are lefties). > > > Sergio Ramos > > > Ivanovic, Branislav > > > 147 > > > Right defenders who can on occasion also play CD, good in the air and a > > threat on set pieces. Hmmm... > > 124... Ivanovic was a good pick, I am surprised at the scoring potential. Other players who come to mind are not numerous: Micah Richards (really?), Corluka, and how about Abidal? > > > Piqué, Gerard > > > Nesta, Alessandro > > > 151 > > > We should be able to do better than this > > Indeed: 102... Again a surprise how badly Nesta compares. Both similar in terms of temperament and playing style. How about: Lucio (though looks more aggressive on the surface and doesn't have the range of passing from the back), Marquez. > > > Puyol, Carles > > > Cannavaro, Fabio > > > 157 > > 123 CB who can play wide too? Ivanovic? Burdisso? > > FM overestimates Cannavaro's current skills. > > (145th player in the world, 23th central defender. A bit overrated.) > > > > Capdevila, Joan > > > Cole, Ashley > > > 156 > > 100 > > > How about Abidal, or Maxwell? Maxwell seems good, I'm not sure about Abidal who's taller and can play inside as well. Other choices: Insua, Evra, Clichy. > If someone picks them... Or we could have unlimited submission per > RSSer (as long as the limit to already picked players remains!). > > > > Busquets, Sergio > > > Touré, Yaya > > > 121 > > > Difficult to beat. > > You can go down to 105. And Toure isn't among the 10 players most > similar to Busquets! He's dime a dozen, this guy! How about: Poulsen, Song, and my man Fernando? > > > Xabi Alonso > > > Gago, Fernando > > > 109 > > > Looks pretty cloneworthy. > > He is! Gago is the perfect Xabi Alonso clone! :) Great pick! > > > Iniesta, Andrés > > > Nasri, Samir > > > 127 > > > Difficult to beat > > Indeed. Nasri is 3rd. The best possible score is 125. Iniesta is > Iniesta is Iniesta. hmmm tough... maybe Cole (the other one), Seedorf... > > > Xavi > > > Pirlo, Andrea > > > 99 > > > Wow, must be the clone! > > He is! > > > > Pedro > > > Arshavin, Andrey > > > 172 > > > Here I think we have to look for someone not quite as established as the > > names we have made so far. > > Hmm, I know just 2 of the 10 best Pedro clones... The best one scores > 114. Good luck with this one! > > > Villa, David > > > Tevez, Carlos > > > 125 > > > Difficult to beat. > > True: Tevez is 2nd! There is just a 124 above him. Rooney? Aguero? > Summing up: Xabi-Gago and Xavi-Pirlo are perfect couples. Among the > other players, there is a lot of room for improvement in some cases, > almost no room in other. The least clonable Spanish player is Iniesta, > the most clonable is Xavi (at least, he has one good clone!). > > And finally the answer to the most crucial question: the distance > among the two generic midgets (I mean Xavi and Iniesta!) is... 152! > > -- > Cheers > milivella
From: Futbolmetrix on 22 Jul 2010 23:32 "Abubakr" <deltarasha(a)gmail.com> wrote in message news:ed78d597-a104-4f2b-9358-35c1e315d612(a)q21g2000prm.googlegroups.com... On Jul 23, 9:50 am, milivella <milive...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > He is! Gago is the perfect Xabi Alonso clone! :) > Great pick! The question is, why did Real Madrid get Xabi when they already had Gago? Not that it wasn't a great move, mind you, if only because it contributed to reduce Gago's playing time. Less playing time, less exposure, lower probability of getting called up to the NT: good outcomes all around! D
From: Futbolmetrix on 22 Jul 2010 23:47
"milivella" <milivella(a)gmail.com> wrote in message news:046d060e-5f10-4b53-8c93-b2a136430af4(a)j8g2000yqd.googlegroups.com... Futbolmetrix: > Too simplicistic. Thanks for the great analysis. > And - even if this tells more about my ignorance than about those > players - I don't know a lot of these 110 players (the 10 players most > similar to each of the Spanish ones). BTW, there is a player who is > among the 10 most similar players for *three* different elements of > the Spanish side. I know him :) and nobody has named so far. And he's > not a midget! (179 cm) I've got no idea who this player could be, but I'm guessing that that the three Spanish players he is similar to are Xabi Alonso, Busquets and Xavi. > And finally the answer to the most crucial question: the distance > among the two generic midgets (I mean Xavi and Iniesta!) is... 152! Other interesting distance questions: 1) what's the distance between Xabi Alonso and Aquilani (the player who supposedly cam in to replace him at Liverpool. 2) What's the distance between Xabi Alonso and Poulsen, the player that Juve management decided to after when they realized that Alonso was too expensive? 3) What's the distance between Trezeguet and Amauri? Any others? |